Rylitah
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  • Mod update: I've went through and edited the Anri thread. Sorry for the wait! I've left the mod notice on each post that I edited for transparency purposes (having a mod edit note on it doesn't necessarily mean anything bad was said, there were a few instances where posts were removed or merged together because initial context was removed and those leftover posts didn't make sense on their own).

    I did my best to make sure that everyone's opinions and critiques on certain trends that weren't attacking other users were kept intact - there were only certain things/even just single words that I wanted to remove, not silence people entirely. Please let me know if there's anything further that needs editing, or if you just don't agree with something that was removed and we can discuss restoring it.

    And once again, I'm sorry it took so long to get this done! I wanted to do this before the holidays here hit at the very least. I'm still very aware that editing this thread may not resolve everything, especially to absolve certain feelings that were left from it, but I hope this will establish our moderating policy from here on out and we'll do our best to make sure VVN continues to be a space where everyone feels safe and welcomed.
    Thinking about how skeevy it was for SSS to have done crowdfunding campaigns for Itako and Zunko's NEUTRINO banks (free voicebanks!) and then turn around then sell them for money (CeVIO AI) later. The nature of it making it so that even if you supported their NEUTRINO campaigns, if you want the CeVIO AI ones too you'll have to pay full price
    Rylitah
    Rylitah
    With Kiritan I don't care because she wasn't crowdfunded to begin with, SSS just did that on their own and released the data for free (which also begs the question of why did Itako and Zunko need to be crowdfunded if they had the funds to do this to begin with along with having the funds to put all three of them on CeVIO without crowdfunding... but okay).

    Of course, I don't know 100% that Itako and Zunko's CeVIO AI banks are using their NEUTRINO data. But considering Kiritan's sure does, I have little reason to believe that these will be new. Kiritan's CeVIO AI bank took a while to release after the announcement even though the recordings were all done, so I don't really take a lack of an exact release date to mean that they're rerecording.
    peaches2217
    peaches2217
    SSS never ceases to surprise me. They’re so blatantly shady. Crowdfunding for free VBs that don’t need crowdfunded and then releasing the exact same VBs for $100 a pop? Selling NFTs and responding to the criticism with “Lol sucks to suck, we really don’t care”?

    Man, why does the fandom hate on Yamaha so hard when SSS is literally right there :clara_ani_lili:
    Prism
    Prism
    I could be wrong but I think with the neutrino banks you have to get a special license form SSS if you want to release music with them commercially and I think the cevio banks have that included. Also I looked into the database side of it and kiritan was made for research and ai development I think in partnership with a university so I think that's where they got the funding. So it makes sense that they might need funding for itako dataset and since it was so successful they made datasets for other ai projects like for tts and for lip reading and got it all painstakingly labeled (basically think to but for hours of data) so it cost a lot of money. The crowdfunding problem I do have is with zunko it was just for her neutrino bank not a dataset for everyone to work with or to improve the technology. I think the massive success of cevio kiritan made them want to bring them over and they had the money from kiritan. It makes sense people want them on the engine if kiritan was any sign. Cevio does have an actually editor and looks easy to edit even if the output is very similar cevio does have a easier workflow for people used to vocaloid.
    Quick mod post (this is also partly a personal post, didn't run this by any other mod aside from saying I'm gonna post something so please dont kill me): A lot of things have been happening on VVN that's been making people feel uncomfortable and unwelcome. I want to tell everyone here that we've absolutely been talking about it - initially we were going off of what just we have been observing, but some people have ended up messaging us which really helps us get a wider perspective on various happenings. We absolutely are going to retroactively review older posts, even deleting more offensive ones that we didn't realize were harmful at the time - we fully understand that doing something now may do little to help anyone as it would have when things were actually happening, but we want to start setting a precedent of intervening more when things get out of hand. (If your post gets deleted, we'll let you know along with the reason why, don't worry. We'll delete posts that we think have no place still being up after certain things have come to light, but we'll also be deleting posts that were made in response to or about those posts - nobody will be punished or penalized for having posts removed in this manner.)

    (This section onwards are more personal, the other mods have the same or similar sentiments but I specifically am only speaking for myself here!)
    I'm sorry it's taken so long for us to do anything about it - some things haven't been sitting well with me either but I either didn't want to take drastic action without consulting other mods first, or situations have ended before I even realize anything's happened so I assumed things were okay. There are issues with both of those approaches though, and I'm going to try and change how I go about moderation as a result. Again, if anyone ever has a concern about another user or just a general comment about a thread or ongoing atmosphere or literally anything at all, please message any of us about it and we'll look into it immediately (we may not realize something's a problem if it isn't brought up to us). Our goal is to make VVN a better place for everyone.

    As for why I'm posting this, I just don't want anyone to think that there isn't anything going on behind the scenes. I'm not sure when exactly we'll be able to enact these changes, but I want to do it as soon as possible - whether that's in the next few days or takes a little bit longer as we iron out exactly what we're going to do, I want people to know that we're not just idly sitting by and letting things happen orz. There's absolutely conversation happening! Which I understand may be hard to believe while everything on site remains untouched for now, but that's why I'm posting this. And again, please message us if there's anything at all you'd like to contribute - you're all part of VVN and your experience and opinion is valuable to us.
    Rylitah
    Rylitah
    I accidentally unapproved my own comment wtf

    One last thing!! If you're not comfortable directly messaging any of us, feel free to use the report button as a way of distancing yourself and keeping yourself out of any private conversation with any particular mod - it'll still be brought to our attention, you can write what issues or concerns you have in the text box, and the mod team will be able to see it and discuss it all the same. Just wanna put that out there as another method of contacting us!
    peaches2217
    peaches2217
    Thank you so, so much. You guys are amazing!!
    morrysillusion
    morrysillusion
    i appreciate knowing that you all are discussing in order to be more aware- its certainly no fault of yours of the staff for being unaware if no one were to come forward... but im glad more awareness has come from people speaking of it- nothing can truly change if the people who have problems cannot come forward to express what the problems are. it all takes time of course and i am have confidence in how the staff handles themselves here, its definitely why i stick around.
    Actually I've changed my mind I want Kotonoha English now O_O
    Rylitah
    Rylitah
    I still wish they were higher quality but there's specific videos I really want to make but couldn't because it'd be a pain editing so many Voiceroids into English.... but with the Kotonohas and Maki that's at least three English characters.... definitely could start a series I've always wanted to do with multiple talking characters...
    patuk
    patuk
    same, I've started enjoying TTS after Maki and it's tempting when there isn't huge catalogue to choose from in eng ghjkbj prolly good idea to support it to make the future brighter so to say. To be able to use english voices in AI voice interface is pretty exciting.
    Rylitah
    Rylitah
    Yeah, absolutely!! I'll probably always have this initial grievance with them, but I do really wanna support more English TTS products... no better way than to buy them, and I do have an actual usage plan for them. I haven't actually used A.I.VOICE myself yet but the interface still looks the same as other VOICEROID/AI Talk products, so I think there will be a ton of flexibility and a lot more editing capabilities than I can get with Maki in CeVIO AI's editor (which I do enjoy using, but there's just a lot I wish I could edit that I just can't).

    Definitely really excited for them now!
    It's a little sad how good A.I.VOICE sounds in general and then they went "yeah this is great" when it came to English
    Rylitah
    Rylitah
    I'm just a little baffled because AI JP has made TTS in many different languages already. These examples are mechanical, but they're really old and yet honestly still sound serviceable enough - I would've expected them to have improved greatly since then instead of just... outsourcing this engine to another company?? Their literal competitor???

    what the hell is going on
    peaches2217
    peaches2217
    I'm hoping and praying it's a similar case to Maki English, where some of her demos sounded stilted and mechanical simply because her team wasn't super well-versed in English, but the end product sounded excellent in the hands of English speakers. That said, the demos are certainly disappointing... I'm glad I don't much care for the Kotonohas, because that means I get to hold out hope that they improve by the next English release, should there be one :clara_ani_lili:
    Rylitah
    Rylitah
    I actually don't really have a problem with the English at all - I've seen people say they were hard to understand, but I could understand them perfectly and was pretty impressed by it. The problem is.... the usual CeVIO/Techno Speech noise that I thought AI JP would be free from, because they sound incredibly low quality for a product they're asking $100+ for orz. Their Japanese banks are perfectly fine but the English quality just sounds like garbage in comparison - even CeVIO AI sounds much better than this. (I've seen people say it sounds like Techno Speech's super old synthesis quality from around 2013? Don't know how true that is or not though on my end)

    I was super excited to see the announcement, but the samples really disappointed me. I'll hold out and listen to usages later to see if I'll end up getting them eventually... but I thought we'd finally have basically the promised VOICEROID English - instead what we're getting sounds like CeVIO with the AI Talk interface ;; (which honestly may not be terrible; I love Maki's CeVIO Talk after using her for a bit but the UI and tuning in general still leaves so much to be desired... editing the Kotonohas will probably be much easier if I can get around the sound quality orz)
    May have taken advantage of the DLsite coupon and split the cost of Maki English with a friend and got her for $28
    • Love
    Reactions: peaches2217
    Rylitah
    Rylitah
    Do I have the CeVIO AI talk editor no but the friend I split the cost with does and I can use her whenever I want
    (kept flipping back and forth on buying her but for $28.... i can't exactly say no)
    peaches2217
    peaches2217
    Have fun! She's a really good girl~
    Prism
    Prism
    Oooo there's a dl site coupon?
    It's literally a battlefield trying to get AHS merch before they sell out (tried to get the keychains since they're finally being sold online.... Yukari and Akari sold out in less than five minutes.... KOU sold out within the hour..... hell on earth)
    Rylitah
    Rylitah
    I did manage to get Kou at least. And a whole bunch of others since I'm buying for other people too but man it was so scary
    patuk
    patuk
    I believe in you! Youll get them one day! 😫
    CeVIO is truly the curse that keeps on giving
    MillyAqualine
    MillyAqualine
    Now low-key imagining what if somebody could use kotonofader on a same sample between her VOCALOID and her Cevio voices to know how an in-between would have felt (though patuk lowered her cevio and even it was slightly different from her vocaloid side, so perhaps it gives off quite an idea)
    patuk
    patuk
    @MillyAqualine yeah format shifting aside, the cevio vb is tonally different too, if you pitch Ia's vocaloid vb up it also doesn't sound just like how her Cevio jp does by default
    does anyone have Chiyu R2's installer that they can send me.... got a new PC yesterday and I've transferred and activated everyone except her since I've misplaced her installer OTL
    • Like
    Reactions: Kazumimi
    Kazumimi
    Kazumimi
    If you still need her, I believe I have her installer!! Just let me know and I'll get it to you ASAP!
    Rylitah
    Rylitah
    I do still need her, thank you so much!!
    my favorite utau's 10th anniversary is today (in japan anyway).... important announcement incoming.... waaaah
    Rylitah
    Rylitah
    I'm 99% positive it's a talk synth for him because his VP's mentioned it way back before everyone started making talk synths... and now that Coefont exists (which I feel is what he used) the time is very ripe
    Rylitah
    Rylitah
    of course i have a cover ready to upload very soon too. hehe
    It seems the original five Arsmagna members, Arsloid's VP included, are leaving (graduating) the group in December.
    Apparently Kiritan was on Japanese television in a spot about her having a realistic voice..... and was labeled as a Vocaloid lol
    Oh turns out a Cul plush IS included in one of Rosa's CF tiers, but it's only the.... the 60,000 yen (~$550 USD) one. And technically the 200,000 yen (~$1,825 USD) tier too since that includes the 60k yen one. Also these two tiers are only for JP backers.
    It's nice that companies can actually... push out free updates to their vocals now, which was something that Yamaha pretty famously disallowed at least pre-V5 (though Crypton got around it once in the case of the Kagamines' Act 1/2). In CeVIO AI's case though I think it's pretty clear the update is more on Techno-Speech's end.
    the pain of having a specific song i want to cover with maki english but it not having an instrumental... the game it's from's soundtrack Supposedly is releasing this month but there's no guarantee the instrumental will be on there... pain
    Prism
    Prism
    Spleeter or izotope rx8 is your friend.
    Rylitah
    Rylitah
    Oh, I'm aware of that site and a few others - they aren't perfect though so I'm holding out for an official release of the instrumental, but if it's not included on the soundtrack then it was my plan to do it myself, haha.
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