Question Meaning of Black Keys

[mobius017]

So I've been making good on my goal of going through some music theory textbooks. I've gotten through the notation stuff and have arrived at the major scales.

As per my book, notes are separated by half and whole steps, which are 1 and 2 keys apart on the piano, respectively.

The major scale is composed of 2 tetrachords, which are each four notes in a pattern of whole step, whole step, half step. The tetrachords have a whole step between them. A scale can begin on any note.

"Great," I'm thinking. "So theoretically, as long as you know the pattern, you can start on any note and generate a new major scale."

That works, I think, just working up the note names on the staff, which line up with the white keys. But then, unless you have a keyboard in front of you, how do you know where the black keys fall?

It seems like there must be some deeper meaning behind whole/half steps that gives rise to the particular placements of the black keys, since there isn't a black key between every 2 white keys. (Something a piano maker would surely have to have known before the piano was invented.) Does anyone know what that reason is?

 

[squeaky_chair]

But then, unless you have a keyboard in front of you, how do you know where the black keys fall?

Just gotta memorize them. There's only five, so it's not super difficult. Learning the key signatures is helpful, which is best done using pencil and manuscript paper. Try writing out all the key signatures in order, then try writing them out again using only notes and no key signature (use accidentals in place of a key signature).

Just remember that key signatures add black notes progressively. For example, G major uses F#; D major uses F# and C#; A major uses F#, C# and G#; etc. Flats are essentially the same, but in reverse order starting with Bb. This helps with memorizing placement. In case you don't know the order of key signatures, it's all about jumping up fifths from C major for sharps, or dropping down fifths from C major for flats. The addition of sharps and/or flats also changes in fifths.

 

[summers50]

idk the history of it
but the easiest way to see that the keyboard that it has two groups of blacks, 2 black keys and 3 black keys

group of 2 starts C, then D E
group of 3 starts F and ends on B

 

[mobius017]

idk the history of it
but the easiest way to see that the keyboard that it has two groups of blacks, 2 black keys and 3 black keys

group of 2 starts C, then D E
group of 3 starts F and ends on B

Ha ha, yeah, I was just looking at that. The notes on the piano repeat CDEFGABC, and it seems like you could also say that there is one black key between each note and its neighbor, unless the notes concerned are B and C, or E and F.

Maybe stupid idea

Maybe a good place for a new mnemonic: Brown Cows Eat Fudge

 

[uncreepy]

But then, unless you have a keyboard in front of you, how do you know where the black keys fall?

I've learned a small bit of piano in the past, but I'm serious about trying to learn guitar, so I'll kind of give you a different perspective.

The 1st string I learned was the top E string, and I learned the F note (1st fret) and G note (3rd fret) on there. In between those is F# (aka B flat).

For a long while, all the beginner songs I played were only "white key" songs (so A, B, C, D, E, F, G, no sharps/flats). We only played notes as far as fret #3 (since the notes repeat).

After a while, they introduced the 1st example from this image:

When, at the start of a line there is one # before the time signature, it means that all the F's are sharp in the song.
If there are 2 #'s, it means that all Fs and Cs are sharp in the song.

So, I since I learned all the "white key" notes and just had to "fill in the gaps" on the fretboard that I didn't know how to play by realizing they were sharps/flats. You just have to know the order of the notes (A B C D E F G, alphabetical order) and assume what goes in between them (ex: between A and B is clearly A sharp/B flat) (since the "white notes" are basically odd numbered frets and the even are sharps/flats).

Sometimes they will mark specific notes as sharp or flat during a song, though (I guess if it's beginner sheet music?): Check out this song and you'll see a few random notes with a # symbol next to them.

When you play the instrument enough, you will begin to remember which notes aren't paired with a sharp/flat (B + C and E + F). It helps to just say the notes out loud as you play the note.

I looked up about why each note doesn't have a black key, apparently it is so that it's easy to identify where you are on the keyboard (since the black keys alternate between sets of 2 and 3). Can you imagine a piano that literally was "white key, black key, white key, black key..." it would be hard to know what octave you're on.

 

[DaSpookyReaper]

Perhaps this could help:

Equal-teperament-tuing, third paragraph

As for why the black semitones are placed this way, well the best explaination I could find was this:
asymmetrical layouts of a piano, up-to fifth paragraph on answer

Basically they figured out the 7-tones scales first and to accompany for inventions of more complex melodies, modulation and modes etc. they had to physically add new hammers to vibrate the strings to produce those semitones on top the 7 hammers which they've already had, as to how they figured out the A natural minor (aeolian mode) and the discovery of the major scale which all other common European modes would later derived from is a whole other can of worms.

Edit: and the interval between Maj3rd and Perfect4 is a technically called a quarter tone which i guess wasn't widely used in Europe though in Arabic culture it was done and due to that they had their own tuning systems before the two cultures met.
@uncreepy the song specifically marked C with the sharp is because C# isn't in F major and the composer specifically wanted borrow use C# in the melody he/she wrote would be the reason, even though the composer did sharp all the P5s but I think in modern music literature there isn't a key signature for a major #5/b6 scale but I'm sure there's a name for this scale somewhere invented by some jazz or classical guy :)

 

[mobius017]

Thank you very much to everyone for your answers!

I've learned a small bit of piano in the past, but I'm serious about trying to learn guitar, so I'll kind of give you a different perspective.

Oh, cool, good for you! Good luck!

The 1st string I learned was the top E string, and I learned the F note (1st fret) and G note (3rd fret) on there. In between those is F# (aka B flat).


For a long while, all the beginner songs I played were only "white key" songs (so A, B, C, D, E, F, G, no sharps/flats). We only played notes as far as fret #3 (since the notes repeat).


After a while, they introduced the 1st example from this image:

When, at the start of a line there is one # before the time signature, it means that all the F's are sharp in the song.

If there are 2 #'s, it means that all Fs and Cs are sharp in the song.


So, I since I learned all the "white key" notes and just had to "fill in the gaps" on the fretboard that I didn't know how to play by realizing they were sharps/flats. You just have to know the order of the notes (A B C D E F G, alphabetical order) and assume what goes in between them (ex: between A and B is clearly A sharp/B flat) (since the "white notes" are basically odd numbered frets and the even are sharps/flats).


Sometimes they will mark specific notes as sharp or flat during a song, though (I guess if it's beginner sheet music?): Check out this song and you'll see a few random notes with a # symbol next to them.

What you've described sounds like what I've been reading. G Major uses the second tetrachord from C Major and then goes one tetrachord higher. So it ends up skipping up 1 whole step (2 piano keys), then starting the second tetrachord on D, then going up 2 more whole steps (to E and F#) and a half step (up 1 piano key, to G)). The reason F has to be sharp is to maintain the whole-whole-half step pattern of the tetrachord--F natural is right next to E on the keyboard, so the scale has to go up one piano key higher to make a whole step.

I looked up about why each note doesn't have a black key, apparently it is so that it's easy to identify where you are on the keyboard (since the black keys alternate between sets of 2 and 3). Can you imagine a piano that literally was "white key, black key, white key, black key..." it would be hard to know what octave you're on.

That's certainly true--if the keyboard all looked the same, it would be very difficult to tell where you were.

Perhaps this could help:



Equal-teperament-tuing, third paragraph


As for why the black semitones are placed this way, well the best explaination I could find was this:

asymmetrical layouts of a piano, up-to fifth paragraph on answer


Basically they figured out the 7-tones scales first and to accompany for inventions of more complex melodies, modulation and modes etc. they had to physically add new hammers to vibrate the strings to produce those semitones on top the 7 hammers which they've already had, as to how they figured out the A natural minor (aeolian mode) and the discovery of the major scale which all other common European modes would later derived from is a whole other can of worms.


Edit: and the interval between Maj3rd and Perfect4 is a technically called a quarter tone which i guess wasn't widely used in Europe though in Arabic culture it was done and due to that they had their own tuning systems before the two cultures met.

Hmm, that's interesting, thanks! It really does give you an appreciation for the history and how many different things came to influence the modern musical system!

 

[squeaky_chair]

That's certainly true--if the keyboard all looked the same, it would be very difficult to tell where you were.

Just be thankful that enharmonic keyboards have been relegated to the dustbin of history. Even if you knew where you were, you'd be lost.

 

[mobius017]

Just be thankful that enharmonic keyboards have been relegated to the dustbin of history. Even if you knew where you were, you'd be lost.

Ouch, those do look like nightmare keyboards. I like the music, though :).