Reminds me of The Ultramind, the greatest evil genius in the history of evil geniuses.
(If for some strange reason the timestamp doesn't work, skip ahead to 7:25 to see The Ultramind in action.)
Examining Anatomy Mistakes in Vocal Synth Art for Fun and Profit
- Thread starter lIlI
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(If for some strange reason the timestamp doesn't work, skip ahead to 7:25 to see The Ultramind in action.)
I don't know if you'd call it a mistake per se, but I noticed that Nakumo (Neutrino) appears to have clubbed thumbs in his concept art... just like me 
This is not bad anatomy related, but I don't think it warrants its own thread so I just wanted to say-- I think NAKUMO has a sick design. It's very distinct despite being conceptually and visually simple. Good synth dude
As fun as it is to dunk on the art, we can always take the time to appreciate a good design!
I have double-jointed arms, so I really relate to some of the early crypton character designs LOL
They're lucky they have those puffy sleeves, or else everyone would be onto them about their little spaghetti arms (cough, rin's v2 art, cough)
Speaking of Crypton proportions:
Miku is about 5'2" and 92 and a half pounds (158cm, 42kg, BMI 16.8). Makes sense. Her official designs are usually very slim and she looks pretty skinny in a lot of her art (some people draw her a bit heavier-looking though, Miku V4 Chinese and ESPECIALLY Magical Mirai 2016 come to mind).
Rin's about 5'0" and 95 pounds (152cm, 43kg, BMI 18.6), which actually puts her at a healthy weight (borderline underweight but still past the healthy-weight line).
Len's about 5'1" and 103 and a half pounds (156cm, 47kg, BMI 19.3), also a pretty healthy weight. A bit heavier than Rin for obvious reasons (he's a boy, he's got more muscle).
But Luka...About 5'4" and 99 pounds (162cm, 45kg), giving her a BMI of 17.1- underweight and BARELY more than Miku? And she looks like THIS?
It's also funny that Rin and Len are technically the "fattest" in official weight of the CV series and they're pretty skinny XD
Anyway, Miku, Rin and Len have pretty proportionate heights and weights for their appearances, but I kinda prefer when I thought Luka was 120 pounds, it makes so much more sense and makes me less concerned for her well-being (Miku's a bit skinnier than her but at least her body type decently matches her weight).
Like, is it even possible to weigh that little and have curves like that? Comment if you know!
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On that note, AVANNA's concept size of 5'6" and 156 pounds I can imagine, she looks pretty curvy to me. However, AkiGlancy later said she imagines AVANNA to be around 110lbs, which is underweight and puts her in a Luka situation if she's to be the same height as her concept.
Also, Yuezheng Ling, who's skinnier than Miku! She's 160cm and 41kg, putting her at a BMI of exactly 16. I swear in her drawings she looks like she's got meat on her bones!
OK, except her concept art, though she still doesn't look thinner than Miku.
But her V3 and V5?
Anime logic I guess? Or maybe her insides are really light?
IA's a TEENSY TINY bit skinnier than Miku and also a bit shorter than her (155cm, 40kg; about 5'1", 88lbs, BMI 16.6), but she at least looks the part. Ling not so much.
Oh, and we can't forget Kaai Yuki being "as tall as 10 big apples" and "as heavy as 86 apples". What the heck AHS.
TL/DR: Fictional character height/weight is wack.
Also, Yuezheng Ling, who's skinnier than Miku! She's 160cm and 41kg, putting her at a BMI of exactly 16. I swear in her drawings she looks like she's got meat on her bones!
OK, except her concept art, though she still doesn't look thinner than Miku.
But her V3 and V5?
Anime logic I guess? Or maybe her insides are really light?
IA's a TEENSY TINY bit skinnier than Miku and also a bit shorter than her (155cm, 40kg; about 5'1", 88lbs, BMI 16.6), but she at least looks the part. Ling not so much.
Oh, and we can't forget Kaai Yuki being "as tall as 10 big apples" and "as heavy as 86 apples". What the heck AHS.
TL/DR: Fictional character height/weight is wack.
YEAH AND HER WEIGHT IS SO LOW
it makes no sense
like, miku has kinda wide hips but i think that's implied to be how she's built, since her legs are skinny too. and on ling those are NOT skinny legs. i think miku's an example of a character whose size makes sense XD
What a coincidence, I was curious about this just the other day and made many of the same discoveries you did! BMI is notoriously not a great metric for measuring real people, but for fictional characters like this it can be useful for analyzing what kind of ideas about weight the artists might have, and... boy howdy do a lot of these characters- female ones especially, how 'bout that?- have body mass indices that would be considered too low in real life. And yet, as has been discussed, a lot of them really don't look that way; seems to me that the artists want to have their cake (curvy, conventionally attractive ladies) and eat it too (still conform to rigid and, frankly, dangerous ideals of weight and beauty).
Most surprising to me however was that Momone Momo apparently has a BMI of about 23? Which made me think I had the math wrong or was mistaken about her official stats but no: 150cm and 52kg, huh. Good for her!
Most surprising to me however was that Momone Momo apparently has a BMI of about 23? Which made me think I had the math wrong or was mistaken about her official stats but no: 150cm and 52kg, huh. Good for her!
I've always had the impression that the stats for the characters' height and weight were an afterthought and just there for fun trivia. The beauty of fiction and stylized art is that... things don't have to make sense. I don't speak for everyone, but when I'm coming up with character designs, I don't think about anything in terms of realism or concrete measurements--I just work out some basic things that I want my character to have and draw based on those criteria.
The only time I'd really be concerned is if they were targeted towards a young, impressionable audience specifically or were being presented in a way that says "you need to look like this and only this", but most vocal synths just present as "hey, here's our cool looking mascot character btw look at our software". Not saying it can't still be an issue, but I've honestly seen things that are much worse and concerning. (I've seen some pretty creepy stuff on some art sites! I do NOT want to know what's going on in the heads of some people!!)
I don't look at Luka, for example, and immediately think I have to look like that. I just think "oh, cool character design" and move along. Now, if she were being presented in a manner that says "hey, every female should look like this or they're not 'beautiful'" then I'd certainly raise my brow and maybe write something a little critical about CFM.
Anyhow, I can see how this could get into some pretty touchy territory so I'll leave off with, analyzing anatomy mistakes is fun but let's remember to be careful in how we discuss it to avoid accidental body-shaming or discussing too much of a sensitive topic in general. (Since height and weight can be a huge insecurity or concern for some people.)
Anyways, I wanted to bring some silly anatomical errors to point out, but I couldn't find any art where it's super silly and obvious. Though is it me or is Yohio a bit long? Something about him feels a little off!
The only time I'd really be concerned is if they were targeted towards a young, impressionable audience specifically or were being presented in a way that says "you need to look like this and only this", but most vocal synths just present as "hey, here's our cool looking mascot character btw look at our software". Not saying it can't still be an issue, but I've honestly seen things that are much worse and concerning. (I've seen some pretty creepy stuff on some art sites! I do NOT want to know what's going on in the heads of some people!!)
I don't look at Luka, for example, and immediately think I have to look like that. I just think "oh, cool character design" and move along. Now, if she were being presented in a manner that says "hey, every female should look like this or they're not 'beautiful'" then I'd certainly raise my brow and maybe write something a little critical about CFM.
Anyhow, I can see how this could get into some pretty touchy territory so I'll leave off with, analyzing anatomy mistakes is fun but let's remember to be careful in how we discuss it to avoid accidental body-shaming or discussing too much of a sensitive topic in general. (Since height and weight can be a huge insecurity or concern for some people.)
Anyways, I wanted to bring some silly anatomical errors to point out, but I couldn't find any art where it's super silly and obvious. Though is it me or is Yohio a bit long? Something about him feels a little off!
In Miku and IA's case it fits their concepts and complements their designs, but for Ling there's literally no reason for her to be that severely underweight, I don't think there's a single clue in her bio. (Uhh, metabolism maybe?) Miku is generally portrayed with a dainty appearance and has a bit of a retro-futurism aesthetic going on (and is possibly retro-sci-fi-anime-inspired, and generally thought to enjoy stuff like green onions and vegetable juice which I wouldn't imagine is all that fattening), and IA seems somewhat ethereal and otherworldly and a slim figure often goes along with that.
But sometimes the exceptions work. Magical Mirai '16 Miku has a bit more weight on her bones in her album art and honestly she's adorable.
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I mean, he's aI've always had the impression that the stats for the characters' height and weight were an afterthought and just there for fun trivia. The beauty of fiction and stylized art is that... things don't have to make sense. I don't speak for everyone, but when I'm coming up with character designs, I don't think about anything in terms of realism or concrete measurements--I just work out some basic things that I want my character to have and draw based on those criteria.
The only time I'd really be concerned is if they were targeted towards a young, impressionable audience specifically or were being presented in a way that says "you need to look like this and only this", but most vocal synths just present as "hey, here's our cool looking mascot character btw look at our software". Not saying it can't still be an issue, but I've honestly seen things that are much worse and concerning. (I've seen some pretty creepy stuff on some art sites! I do NOT want to know what's going on in the heads of some people!!)
I don't look at Luka, for example, and immediately think I have to look like that. I just think "oh, cool character design" and move along. Now, if she were being presented in a manner that says "hey, every female should look like this or they're not 'beautiful'" then I'd certainly raise my brow and maybe write something a little critical about CFM.
Anyhow, I can see how this could get into some pretty touchy territory so I'll leave off with, analyzing anatomy mistakes is fun but let's remember to be careful in how we discuss it to avoid accidental body-shaming or discussing too much of a sensitive topic in general. (Since height and weight can be a huge insecurity or concern for some people.)
Anyways, I wanted to bring some silly anatomical errors to point out, but I couldn't find any art where it's super silly and obvious. Though is it me or is Yohio a bit long? Something about him feels a little off!
View attachment 6972
Yohioloid’s right arm doesn’t look right and the weight placement(right phrase? Idk) for his feet is off. It’s like his upoer body shouldn’t look like that if the poses were correct. (This piece of art has always bugged me)I've always had the impression that the stats for the characters' height and weight were an afterthought and just there for fun trivia. The beauty of fiction and stylized art is that... things don't have to make sense. I don't speak for everyone, but when I'm coming up with character designs, I don't think about anything in terms of realism or concrete measurements--I just work out some basic things that I want my character to have and draw based on those criteria.
The only time I'd really be concerned is if they were targeted towards a young, impressionable audience specifically or were being presented in a way that says "you need to look like this and only this", but most vocal synths just present as "hey, here's our cool looking mascot character btw look at our software". Not saying it can't still be an issue, but I've honestly seen things that are much worse and concerning. (I've seen some pretty creepy stuff on some art sites! I do NOT want to know what's going on in the heads of some people!!)
I don't look at Luka, for example, and immediately think I have to look like that. I just think "oh, cool character design" and move along. Now, if she were being presented in a manner that says "hey, every female should look like this or they're not 'beautiful'" then I'd certainly raise my brow and maybe write something a little critical about CFM.
Anyhow, I can see how this could get into some pretty touchy territory so I'll leave off with, analyzing anatomy mistakes is fun but let's remember to be careful in how we discuss it to avoid accidental body-shaming or discussing too much of a sensitive topic in general. (Since height and weight can be a huge insecurity or concern for some people.)
Anyways, I wanted to bring some silly anatomical errors to point out, but I couldn't find any art where it's super silly and obvious. Though is it me or is Yohio a bit long? Something about him feels a little off!
View attachment 6972
On the topic of anatomy trends, it's been noted that male anime characters tend to have proportions that are almost identical to an average real life man, whereas female characters are much more exaggerated. It's strange when you notice how many artstyles have an averagely proportioned man standing next to a very rare/impossibly proportioned woman: definitely an interesting case study on how double standards impact art. Considering the extensive scientific evidence that being surrounded by unrealistic proportions has a negative impact on body image, I hope future vocal synth designs are more realistic and diverse. I'd be happy to do away with canon weights too, they don't give any useful or interesting information about the character; and I could easily see a young fan looking up their favourite character's canon weight and comparing themselves to it. I can't think of any reason to have body measurements for a PNG that isn't a bit creepy and intrusive. I'm glad Yuki was spared - if we must have canon weights, I only want them in apples, haha.
I suppose so. If each apple is 5 inches tall, that would make her about 50 inches....4'2". That's pretty normal for a Japanese 9-year-old I think. (I used to think "as tall as 10 big apples" was TINY xP)
Also, according to Wat, this is why Miku is slim and pale (quoted directly from this interview Artist Interview: Wataru Sasaki (Crypton Future Media) | Performing Arts Network Japan please don't sue me for plagiarism):
"As for the nuance Hatsune Miku’s white skin and slender figure, I believe it is like the image of the vital spirit projected by the thin, whitish bodies of some Butoh dancers, which appear to be on the borderline between life and death. Rather than an image in the direction of a ghost or a Frankenstein, my image was that of a light-spirited girl with skin lacking in color and vitality; I wanted to get an image of someone that looked like they were about to die, or like they had just died. Wouldn’t that be a look that would suggest human love? And, if she had the look of someone wandering on the borderline between life and death, I thought she would be a character that people could become attached to? I wanted to get a voice quality that would bring the users to a borderline consciousness where they might say either that it was a voice patched together from human voices or that it was something that had the potential to sing, once they bought the Hatsune Miku software and started to use it.
Other things that I referenced were characters like Aegis in the Persona3 game by ATLAS, or an android of the type that appears in The Five Star Stories manga. The things I referenced were mostly rather slender figures. And since I don’t prefer manga characters that have big breasts and a mix of Lolita qualities and maternal qualities, I wanted an impression that was different from that. I wanted a character setting that didn’t project a clear sense of attention or focus but rather that of a vaguely unfocused young girl."
So it's less of an ideal thing with Miku. She's supposed to sort of be...futuristic, ethereal and doll-like, y'know?
I think this sort of appeal is what draws me to her. She's cute and pretty, sure, but she's also got this cool, interesting, mysterious feel to her. I think that blend of cute and appealing with cool and intriguing is why she's my favorite. (IMO her Append and V3 English boxarts lean toward the latter; I'm fonder of Miku's V3E boxart than most tbh.) And also yeah, the above is why she's skinny.
On that note I kinda love the videos of the old concerts where she looks like she's glowing. It just looks so cool to me.
I'd imagine IA's case is similar to Miku's, being a mysterious alien girl. So they're both really skinny for a good reason. But honestly, some loids don't have quite the intriguing designs these two do, and yeah, it'd be good to get more variety. Now that I think of it I don't think we have a single MUSCULAR vocalsynth outside of maybe UTAU...that might be interesting and I think it's something we badly need, as most male vocalsynths pretty much have the same slim body type.
OHH MAN I HAVE AN IDEA
a vocalsynth with an appearance like a robot from like a Western movie? I mean, I guess we do have Chipspeech but it'd be cool to get like an Iron Giant-type design or something, or a more human-shaped design like the Queen from Deltarune or...OOHHH A DAFT PUNK REFERENCE VOCALOID
like, it'd be pretty cool if we started getting non-humanoid designs (no, i don't take the vys to be a literal singing fan and sword)
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about the weight, just adding to the convo that this isn't exclusive to Miku, CFM or vocaloid characters for that matter, it's almost like a trope in japanese media like anime and such, if one were to sort through bunch of other voice synth & anime characters, they'd see much of the same.
i dont dwell on the weights/bmis of vocaloids like miku too much since their characters were intended to be seen more as "robots" or "androids" as opposed to humans. Although, i guess in that sense, id except them to be heavier? i guess depends on what material theyre made out of lol
my body dysmorphic/ednos-having-self eye twitches at unrealistic proportions, but speaking from my personal experiences, i tend to be more triggered by seeing real people with unrealistic proportions as opposed to fictional characters...just because i can be like "haha theyre not real so thats impossible!" but then i see an irl skinny person and cry. but i cant speak for everyone that suffers from the same illnesses as me these were just my thoughts
sorry i really derailed this to trauma dump hhh anyway
i agree with kazumimi that hio looks long, i think his shirt is really long which gives the illusion that he has a very lengthy torso lol. ive noticed common anime art style tropes are women with short torsos and long legs, and men with long torsos in general.
my body dysmorphic/ednos-having-self eye twitches at unrealistic proportions, but speaking from my personal experiences, i tend to be more triggered by seeing real people with unrealistic proportions as opposed to fictional characters...just because i can be like "haha theyre not real so thats impossible!" but then i see an irl skinny person and cry. but i cant speak for everyone that suffers from the same illnesses as me these were just my thoughts
sorry i really derailed this to trauma dump hhh anyway
i agree with kazumimi that hio looks long, i think his shirt is really long which gives the illusion that he has a very lengthy torso lol. ive noticed common anime art style tropes are women with short torsos and long legs, and men with long torsos in general.