Other Cryptonloid voicebank updates, collabs, & concert news (crypton_wat Twitter translations)

[Blue Of Mind]

I'm half-expecting an annoucement of an NT V2 (with hopefully the other Cryptonloids) come August. The current version of NT has been consistently stuck in a beta-like state, rather than felt like a finished professional product, and Crypton has been silent on new, huge updates on NT for ages now.

Tho my cynical ass wishes Crypton would throw the towel on NT and port their banks either to V6 or another synth. But this wouldn't be the least bit fair to people who did pay for Miku NT.

 

[InstallGentoo]

Got Rin/Len V4X English from the promo and I noticed that my Miku NT version is also labelled as discontinued like my Rin/Len V4X registration.

Rin/Len makes sense because they'll be replaced but Crypton either messed up the Miku NT listing or they might announce a new Miku NT & Piapro NT version on the 1st august that will replaced the current one.

Or they'll give up on NT and migrate to Vocaloid 6/SynthV/Cevio AI/Voisona/etc. which is doubtful. (Ngl, I'd be pretty salty if it happens because I bought Miku NT with the expectation that she'll be regularly updated and become a decent Std bank lol)
View attachment 8065

News to me, I checked my account and it says the same thing. It's going to turn out like V2 and V3 I guess. They're going to give up the New Type label? Please don't tell me it has something to do with a shareholder decision and it just new version or mishap not a company shutdown.

 

[MagicalMiku]

I should check my physical box version of Miku NT, but probably that "discountinued" message is only for the digital Sonicwire bought version, bought/activated before July 1st when Cubase wasn't still in the bundle software included.
it's also possible that, like Blue of Mind said, the next update to be announced in August will be like NT V2, which should offer back-compatibility with previous Miku NT. something similar happened with Vocaloid 3-> Vocaloid 4X if i'm not mistaken?
I think there will be positive good news next month, probably that "discountinued" is only for the not-Cubase license, or NT2 will be a major platform upgrade, maybe also iXima will draw new art as well
not a shutdown, because they chose to repackage it, I think they are just preparing for a nice launch ^-^

edit: from your image, looks like also your V4X bundle is "discountinued", so that's probably for the not-Cubase license, which makes sense because now the repackage versions include Cubase, so they can't sell anymore the previous versions.

 

[InstallGentoo]

初音ミクたち歌声合成ソフトウェア製品がリパッケージ！2024年中に新製品も発売予定！ | SONICWIRE BLOG

クリプトン・フューチャー・メディア株式会社は、2024年7月1日（月）付けで、現行の6タイトルの歌声合成ソフト

sonicwire.com

I guess since they swiched the licence to cubase I'll try and learn cubase shortcuts in studio one in the meantime.
Speculation but I'm assuming they made that decision to switch because Cubase probably handles VST plugins and integrates them better. I had trouble with having the playerhead somehow desync with piapro and no midi event or wave form you can see on the track in studio one, so you have to pay attention to the bar and tempo on both. Maybe Cubase will integrate better. and you can work on the other intruments without worrying about desyncing and the weird cpu spikes from having piapro run for a long time (it increased by couple percent over time without editing/adding anything or running anything else).

 

[Vector]

I had trouble with having the playerhead somehow desync with piapro and no midi event or wave form you can see on the track in studio one

This is an inherent limitation of the VST and MIDI standards, actually. They're strictly real-time, MIDI being a chain of pitch/duration events synchronized to a clock pulse and VST operating on an audio signal.

The only way around that is ARA, which is a plugin system that provides additional communication between the plugin host and plugin. Vocaloid 6 supports ARA2, through the included Vocaloid Bridge plugin you drop onto an audio event, while Piapro does not. This gives the V6 editor playhead synchronization, though you still won't see a waveform in the DAW timeline.

That's one of my favorite features of V6 over Piapro Studio, actually: the backing music is always playing and synchronized while working in the V6 editor, and there's no annoying render buffer delay if you start playback in your DAW (since V6 prerenders on edit). Setup is a little bit weird though, since I end up having to make an extra track with a one-bar silent audio clip to drop the Vocaloid Bridge plugin onto (since it goes on an audio event instead of a track itself), but then I hide the track and pretend it doesn't exist.

The bundle change is probably just because the contract was up and Steinberg gave them a better offer than Presonus. (Presonus was also recently purchased, by Fender, I think. There's a possibility that could have been a factor in renewal considerations too.)

 

[MagicalMiku]

the repackaged box is looking so good!!(❁´◡`❁)

(translated)
I wanted the repackaged Hatsune Miku V4X so badly that I bought it on impulse, and the license card is great...! The startup paper also had license card designs for other characters. I'm so happy there are so many Mikus...

 

[WyndReed]

The new package looks pretty good, although I think the old package looks better with Miku from the waist up on the spine. It looks like a standard dvd case now, which makes me wonder if it’s possible to put a disc with the vbs burned on it into the case.

 

[MagicalMiku]

mm.. yes yes, I think is possible to put a disc into the box, as the length dimensions haven't changed ^u^
(I recommend to put the disc into a paper or plastic sleeve, and together with the disc also a small usb pendrive of about 8/16GB)

 

[Wario94]

I noticed this sentence on the top of the back box said "すぐに音楽制作が始められるオールインワンパッケージ" which translated into English as "The all-in-one package to start music production immediately".

 

[Infoholic]

A few things:

1. We were supposed to get a "major NT update" 6 months after last August, which still hasn't happened.
2. In the article, they mention that Crypton V3 and V4 owners will get preferential pricing; they did NOT say it would be limited to Rin/Len or Miku. (No NT discount)
3. Swapping from the old Vocaloid style boxes to NT style boxes
4. DECO releasing new music and crediting the Crypton sound team in the descriptions.

Based on all of these, I'm 99% certain that we're finally getting the major NT update we were promised, as well as the other vocalists. It's very likely that they realized this year is their 20th anniversary of vocal synth sales and decided to delay that March announcement for NT till now. The alleged new Miku in the Deco songs also sounds very NT-like, just much better; and to be quite frank, NT as a software (outside of sound) is actually pretty nice.

I think we're finally getting a major overhaul to NT to where it sounds on-part with their vocaloid products with better usability, and they're going to launch all of the other singers finally for their big 20th anniversary.

 

[BANKARA_TEEvie]

I think we're finally getting a major overhaul to NT to where it sounds on-part with their vocaloid products with better usability, and they're going to launch all of the other singers finally for their big 20th anniversary.

now, honestly? i can get behind this... kinda.
i can certainly see crypton maybe not being so happy with how nt's initial rollout went (with its many delays, not great reception, the strange beta program) and wanting to simply wait until they've made substantial progress in every area so that nt can almost have a second start! that is, of course, if they do plan on that - i can't say i'm not also fearing the big update being, like, a few new vibrato types and one luka japanese-only voicebank release orz
even in the best case scenario where crypton surprises us with a *lot* for the engine, while i understand wanting to just get their heads down and get things done without making false promises, it's sad that it feels like the majority of the community has lost a LOT of faith in crypton as of recent.

like you said though, NT is pretty nice, i find it really fun and intuitive to use, even with such strong engine noise. i can't even imagine people would mind the strong nasal-tone of miku NT if she weren't priced so insanely high for what she is - because at her core, she's a really interesting standard vb with differences from how she was on the vocaloid engine! i love that crypton wants to do something a bit different and a bit more niche w/ their virtual singers, i just think they haven't done their very best in making that happen...

small edit ; i've also been thinking about how, even though crypton dropped out around when v5 was around, i can't help but imagine crypton was demo-ing with v6's AI tech and wasn't super satisfied... and i get it! not every vsynth nowadays *has* to be AI, which is why i love NT trying to be expressive but concatenative! i just think it's not quite... enough to stand on its own, nor the future of cryptonloids that everyone was wishing for at all.

 

[MagicalMiku]

it wasn't an easy choice for Crypton, but they had to choose a different path because they knew Yamaha plans for Vocaloid 5 and 6, and it wasn't what they wanted for their software. Still, they kept and are keeping very good relationship with Yamaha in terms of development of features and technology.
Making your own synth takes lot of time, trials and errors, and I like to think that the planned update for Miku NT (that was supposed to be released this spring) became so good that they decided to rebrand it as NT2 (or any other name) and launch it later this year, with maybe also Rin, Len and Luka.

as I wrote some messages before, I think we'll have very good surprise in August. The whole repackage thing, the going back to Cubase, and the fact that they've announced the date of presentation (August 1st), makes it seems they have important plans: as the Sonicwire article wrote, they are going to release various new products this year, probably NT2 for Miku, Rin and Len, maybe also Luka (or january/february for her), and then next year for Kaito and Meiko.
I also think that they'll offer discounted price for NT2 to anybody that owns NT or has recently bought the repackaged versions

 

[Infoholic]

the reality is, it wasn't an easy choice for Crypton, but they had to choose a different path because they knew Yamaha plans for Vocaloid 5 and 6, and it wasn't what they wanted for their software. Still, they kept and are keeping very good relationship with Yamaha in terms of development of features and technology.
Making your own synth takes lot of time, trials and errors, and I like to think that the planned update for Miku NT (that was supposed to be released this spring) became so good that they decided to rebrand it as NT2 (or any other name) and launch it later this year, with maybe also Rin, Len and Luka.

as I wrote some messages before, I think we'll have very good surprise in August. The whole repackage thing, the going back to Cubase, and the fact that they've announced the date of presentation (August 1st), makes it seems they have important plans: as the Sonicwire article wrote, they are going to release various new products this year, probably NT2 for Miku, Rin and Len, maybe also Luka (or january/february for her), and then next year for Kaito and Meiko.
I also think that they'll offer discounted price for NT2 to anybody that owns NT or has recently bought the repackaged versions

I don't really think Miku will be an NT2; I think she'll just be a free update for people who already bought her, and maybe a price increase of her overall package. Crypton always hated how they couldn't release updates and such to their products in the past outside of releasing something like an ACT2, and NT has an updater for a reason. No reason to have an NT2 when you can just update NT like they can, yknow?

 

[Vector]

So, I'm more convinced there's something to this. I looked and Deco27 did suddenly start putting this on his last three videos (over the past three months), which do have a different sort of vocal sound than his other work:

Special Thanks: Crypton Future Media Sound Team

Listening to "Rookie," I have a few observations:

1. The English bridge doesn't sound like V4 to me. The timbre seems different. The L/R/S sounds seem very natural, and while you can certainly accomplish quality English vocals with V4, it seems a step beyond what I'd expect. I don't have a frame of reference for what Miku NT sounds like when approximating English, but given what I've heard of NT so far, and its lack of an English version, I suspect it would be a very well tuned V4 or something different. That "cadaver" too...Miku V4 hates English "a" sounds, such as in the word "man." (It comes out either mon or mun.) She'd usually want to do a non-rhotic "ah" for the "er" at the end too, or an overly intrusive R sound.

2. In the Japanese parts, I detect a distinct buzziness behind the vocals, which I never notice in V4. I don't know if NT has that, but it sounds a lot like the sort of noise that crops up in Vocaloid 6.

About 1:15:


Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if there were either a V6 bank or a new NT version that's a major leap forward.

 

[Infoholic]

So, I'm more convinced there's something to this. I looked and Deco27 did suddenly start putting this on his last three videos (over the past three months), which do have a different sort of vocal sound than his other work:



Listening to "Rookie," I have a few observations:

1. The English bridge doesn't sound like V4 to me. The timbre seems different. The L/R/S sounds seem very natural, and while you can certainly accomplish quality English vocals with V4, it seems a step beyond what I'd expect. I don't have a frame of reference for what Miku NT sounds like when approximating English, but given what I've heard of NT so far, and its lack of an English version, I suspect it would be a very well tuned V4 or something different. That "cadaver" too...Miku V4 hates English "a" sounds, such as in the word "man." (It comes out either mon or mun.) She'd usually want to do a non-rhotic "ah" for the "er" at the end too, or an overly intrusive R sound.

2. In the Japanese parts, I detect a distinct buzziness behind the vocals, which I never notice in V4. I don't know if NT has that, but it sounds a lot like the sort of noise that crops up in Vocaloid 6.

About 1:15:


Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if there were either a V6 bank or a new NT version that's a major leap forward.

This kind of tuning isn't really achievable in V6 at the moment, and it's engine noise is much heavier. This Miku has her full spectrum of frequencies, whereas V6 has a harsh cut on the high frequencies. Based on these factors, Crypton's disliking of achieving realism, the NT update we were promised last August, and the consonants especially I think it's NT. The English consonants/cadence sound really similar to the Luka English NT we've heard in the past.

The thing is that the NT voicebanks have been finished, they exist, but they've only ever been displayed in Sekai and private usages within Crypton.

 

[Blue Of Mind]

1. The English bridge doesn't sound like V4 to me. The timbre seems different. The L/R/S sounds seem very natural, and while you can certainly accomplish quality English vocals with V4, it seems a step beyond what I'd expect. I don't have a frame of reference for what Miku NT sounds like when approximating English, but given what I've heard of NT so far, and its lack of an English version, I suspect it would be a very well tuned V4 or something different. That "cadaver" too...Miku V4 hates English "a" sounds, such as in the word "man." (It comes out either mon or mun.) She'd usually want to do a non-rhotic "ah" for the "er" at the end too, or an overly intrusive R sound.

Listening to the bridge myself as an English speaker, I agree it doesn't sound like V4. Both V3 and V4 Miku English have unique quirks which make me quickly realise it's the English Vocaloid versions, but that song didn't have them. Either Deco is really good at using V4, or he used a version of NT that's good at approximating English with Japanese banks. Or perhaps there's a Miku English NT bank we haven't heard yet.

 

[blackout]

I also believe that Deco has access to a new/updated Miku bank as well on his newest songs, these might even turn out to be demo examples whenever Crypton unveils whatever they’re planning. Kind of expecting this to be a relaunch of NT, with current Miku NT owners getting the update for free, sorta like Cevio AI 1.0->2.0

Personally really like how Miku sounds especially in Hao, so I’m definitely looking forward to hearing more in August! If we’re getting the NT banks for the rest of the Crypton gang as well I’m also hoping that they’re much improved from how they sound in Sekai, especially Luka and Meiko who have lost so much of their tone in most of the examples even as of recent. Given how even Miku sounds a LOT better in these Deco songs than in any of the game versions, I’m a bit hopeful!

 

[BANKARA_TEEvie]

The English bridge doesn't sound like V4 to me. The timbre seems different. The L/R/S sounds seem very natural, and while you can certainly accomplish quality English vocals with V4, it seems a step beyond what I'd expect. I don't have a frame of reference for what Miku NT sounds like when approximating English, but given what I've heard of NT so far, and its lack of an English version, I suspect it would be a very well tuned V4 or something different. That "cadaver" too...Miku V4 hates English "a" sounds, such as in the word "man." (It comes out either mon or mun.) She'd usually want to do a non-rhotic "ah" for the "er" at the end too, or an overly intrusive R sound.

Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if there were either a V6 bank or a new NT version that's a major leap forward.

a lot of people have been thinking this is the case, while some believe that it's simply the "new tuning style" that deco has also been mentioning here and there. personally? i don't see why both can't be true, especially considering a huge engine overhaul would naturally make *me* experiment with my tuning style a bit!
just like you said though, it's the rhotic /er/ that stands out the most to me - maybe this just sounds mean, but even with as good as deco is at tuning, i wouldn'tve expected him to be the type to make miku sound so fluent, especially in a way that sounds nothing like how other "realistic" and "fluent" english miku users do (like kira, it's SO different!)
SOME people are actually thinking that if nothing else, the english part could be using some kind of off-shoot of what used to be cherry pie, which certainly could be a possibility given how voice changing AI tech has blown up quite a bit recently. either way, all of deco's recent uses of miku sound really great regardless, it just sounds so noticeably different but it's still hard to tell whether it's a new product or not!!

Kind of expecting this to be a relaunch of NT, with current Miku NT owners getting the update for free, sorta like Cevio AI 1.0->2.0

yeah, i would also imagine it being a free upgrade like cevio's vocals... or else crypton will probably be facing the wrath of a lot of very, very angry miku fans.

anyway, seeing as we HAVE heard nt doing english with luka in the past, i can't imagine that NT *won't* ever have support for other languages. i'd find it weird that crypton wants to create this "we connect all people with one voice" vibe - especially kinda theming miku expo around that - just for their most recent version of said voicebank to be locked to jp only ekehfkhdsg.

 

[InstallGentoo]

There's alot of hype I'm sensing. I'll dial it back, it's probably better to just study the phonemens and work off the table to pronounce a different languages in the original voice bank and then try and use a helper tool to reecreate those verbal expressions than a entire new voicebank. It's over 3 gigabites for the software, probably best to develop on technique than fall for gear aquire syndrome. I welcome whatever they have in store for us regardless.

 

[Infoholic]

There's alot of hype I'm sensing. I'll dial it back, it's probably better to just study the phonemens and work off the table to pronounce a different languages in the original voice bank and then try and use a helper tool to reecreate those verbal expressions than a entire new voicebank. It's over 3 gigabites for the software, probably best to develop on technique than fall for gear aquire syndrome. I welcome whatever they have in store for us regardless.

Crypton has never shyed away from large voicebank sizes, Luka V4x alone is proof of that. It's possible that they've also reduced the size of the models in the new NT, though even if they didn't, an unextracted/installed VOCALOID4 English voicebank is already 3-4 GB typically. NT is 3 GB for 3 Japanese voicebanks, which also isn't unusual for them.

It's concatenative synthesis, you can't get what we heard in Rookie without a dedicated English voicebank.